| Redevelopment | Merge with Another Church | Replant | Maintain Accreditation | |
| What does this mean? | Church would lose its full accreditation. District Executive Committee would be the governance authority District would have an Advisory Board of people from Hillcrest Church Church Membership is Frozen (No new church members until full accreditation is obtained) | Another C&MA Church may be interested in having a plant in Roseville. Currently there are no churches interested. If chosen by congregation, Rob would begin a search to see if any Sacramento Area churches are interested. | Hillcrest Church would Close District would give building to a New Church Existing Church Membership is Lost Everyone would start as new members | Church needs to meet its bylaws obligation – of having an *This reflects the clarification we received on our Bylaws on 10/13/25 |
| How is the Pastor decided? | District would appoint a pastor | Merging Church would send pastor | Woody has expressed interest in planting a new Church Possibility of this is dependent on going through Licensing and Ordination process | Congregation would have to form a Pastoral Search Team; and participate in the Pastor Search team activities and recommend a Pastor to the district Pastor is appointed by district superintendent |
| Effect on Congregation | Take a look at your tithing Everyone will need to be involved in serving in regular ministry | Old membership is brought into membership with merging church. Old congregation would mix with new resources and members from the planting church. | Congregation could choose to stay and become members of the new church Or congregation could leave and search for a new church home Example Rob gave about a church in PA: out of 18 families 4 stayed with the new church and the rest moved on | Similar to Redevelopment in that congregants need to: Take a look at your tithing Everyone will need to be involved in serving in regular ministry |
Can you explain what redevelopment means?
You haven’t been able to fulfil the bylaws of the church. There’re actually 7 categories and if 2 of them are a reality it would put you into redevelopment. So, let’s say you say as a church, “We can solve the redevelopment issues because we can find 5 elders.” And if you find 5 qualified men who fulfill the responsibility for eldership then you’d say well, we don’t need to go into redevelopment because we are meeting our bylaws. If you can’t do that, and financial needs go as projected to me, then that would put you as we come to the end of this year/beginning of next year – into redevelopment. And the Superintendent would work with the governance authority who is really now the advisory team and financial decision would have to go through the district executive committee, and we would have to decide if we could survive. Because in the case of Hillcrest Church our attendance is going backwards another step, and can we come out of this? The second question is could we find a pastor to come here. Past 4 years Bruce has been working as a janitor and fulfilling other roles within the church and doing more than he’s paid for. We know that’s not unusual for a small church and Bruce has been very gracious in doing that. But as we look for a new pastor, can you find someone to do that. I’d be very happy if we can fulfill the bylaws and move forward. I would love to see your church grow.
Starting in January the district is providing training for churches like this one on a monthly basis by Zoom for leadership teams to help them grow and move forward. But you have to say we can’t do the same things we’ve been doing the same way or we’re going to close. SO thinking we can do the same things the same way we’re always done it and thinking we’re going to have a different outcome isn’t going to work.
At best in a way its redevelopment or replant because I don’t have anyone that wants to merge with you at this time. So come January or by January that decision has to be made. And my recommendation would be here in November as a congregation have a vote about where you want to go and what you want to do. And whichever way you go if it’s a replant or whatever. If it’s a replant you’d go through the end of the year and make some decision about what the first couple of months of the new year look like. If it’s on to redevelopment and going through the search process we want to get that started as soon as possible. Or if you can fulfill your bylaws and its staying as an accredited church, we need to get that process going so that a search process can take place, right? In Redevelopment the district superintendent can appoint someone to your church as the pastor. So, I want you to understand that [installing a pastor] doesn’t have to come to a vote of the congregation or a vote of the governing board the same way it would as if it was an accredited Church
A potential 4th Option – Maintaining Accreditation
| Maintaining Accreditation | |
| What does this Mean? | Church needs to meet its bylaws obligation – of having an Elder Majority on the board |
| How is Pastor Decided? | Congregation would have to form a Pastoral Search Team; and participate in the Pastor Search team activities. And recommend a Pastor to the district Pastor is appointed by district superintendent |
| Effect on congregation | Similar to Redevelopment in that congregants need to: Take a look at your tithing Everyone will need to be involved in serving in regular ministry |
When you said we would close and come back, would we still be a Christian & Missionary Alliance?
Yes, if this church closes and a new plant opens it will be a Christian & Missionary Alliance church. Woody has spoken to me about an interest in replanting here. That’s the only person I’ve had speak about that. Woody knows he hasn’t finished his application. He would need to go through the accreditation process with the CMA, He’d have to pass that. He’d have to get on the process for ordination and be able to fulfill those requirements and stipulations of being an Alliance pastor. That’s the only way he could replant here as an Alliance church.
So is Hillcrest Church’s Property owned by the Christian & Missionary Alliance?
That’s correct. The reason for that in our bylaws is twofold. Every Alliance church that’s accredited has it in their bylaws what’s called the reversionary clause. And that’s for two reasons. One if the church goes AWOL theologically, its to say you can’t take the property with you if you’re going down a pathway that does agree with us theologically. And two is that if the church declines to such a point that it can’t exist anymore it makes it a seamless process if and when property ever has to be delt with. What I can tell you during my tenure here as superintendent, I have made the decision that to the best of my ability, I never want to get rid of property. I always want to try and help plant another church if at all possible, on the property that we’ve had.
In your experience with churches that are in our situation, how many of them are able to actually grow, increase their membership and come into a really healthy situation? Is that common?
So I would say it’s not common. The key is being able to make decisions you haven’t made yet. So you’ve made decisions that have kept you stagnant and you haven’t made decisions that have been needed to move out of stagnancy for whatever reason, and whatever that looks like. I don’t know but you’ve got a history of being stagnant at 30 to 36 people in the room on a Sunday morning. And the amount of churches I’ve seen turn around from that. There’s some.
I dealt with a church in Western Pennsylvania when I was living there, The church was down to much smaller than your church. They had less than 18 people on a Sunday morning. The pastor left the church and a neighboring Alliance church in NY asked if they could take over the church, and basically plant another church at that location. But what it would require is what I presented to you. Your church would have to die and a replant would happen at that location. That happened in fall of the year. And I think they made the decision they would close just after Christmas if I remember right. The New church came in, they renovated the building and did their kickoff on Easter, and Easter Sunday they had over 200 people and today that church is still going strong, and there was only a couple thousand people in that community. So thin this case there was an influx from a very healthy church that had done this at about three other locations, and this was not another campus from that church. But the DNA from the healthy church and say this is how we’re going to do church going forward brought the change of trajectory, now of those 18 people or so, only 4 or 6 stayed with the replant. Because for others it was too painful for them. So I know as we talk these conversations are very painful, right, but I want to help you think ahead of what January is going to be, what’s march going to be? Because we have to have a plan of action as we are moving in that direction.
If we did the closure and replant, the church would close with the intention of replanting and starting something brand new? So would the people currently here at Hillcrest would they be given the option of staying with the plant?
Correct. And that would assume they want to do that. That would assume they want to be a member of that church, that they buy in with the values and focus of that replant, and that assumes that we have a planter that is going to do the replant. if woody fulfills those obligations as any alliance pastor would.
What percentage of the Christian & Missionary Alliance Churches in this region are doing well?
Out of the 106 CMA churches in our district 53 grew by 3%, I would have to look it up in order to tell you how many are in the stagnant which we figure as +/-3% growth in a year. I can tell you during my tenure as a pastor when I was in Western Pennsylvania the standardized number that we looked at was 70-80% stagnant declining churches, so our district is way beyond the curve with 53 growing at +3% in the last year. This last year we had the highest conversion growth over attendance that we’ve had in the last 5 years of data. We’ve also had the highest amount of baptisms across our district that we’ve had in the last 5 years. In the last 3 years we’ve planted 14 churches, and we have another 10 in progress through adoption or church planting that may come into play already this year. So, our district is not in decline as a whole. As I’ve walked through the district and preached in churches in the last 3 years, I’ve seen over 200 people make decisions for Jesus Christ. So, people have long believed California is closed and hard to the gospel and my personal belief is that they’ve tried everything else. Drugs, money, sex, marriages, everything the world could offer them, and they found it doesn’t work so now they’re ready for Jesus, right? And so, I would just speak hope to you, your neighbors this community is not closed to the gospel, they’re waiting for someone to tell them about Jesus, right? And I’ve had numerous people, and they’re just very open to talk to me about Jesus. And I’m new so I don’t even have the relationships. But I lived in Colorado Springs for 4 years. I can tell you, the people in my neighborhood just a few miles from here in Citrus Heights those people are way more open than the people in Colorado Springs. So, I want you know if you believed that people in California are closed to the gospel you need to change your perspective. Because people here are not closed to the gospel. They just want to know the real Jesus and the true hope that he gives.
What’s Our timeline on making a decision?
My recommendation to you is to, is by mid-November or so that you guys have a congregational meeting and say which way do we want to go and that can then put into place it for Next year. If we’re going to move down a pathway and get 5 elders for next year, if you don’t think you can fulfill those requirements then your option is do we want to go in redevelopment or do we want to go in a replant or do we want to look and see if there are any churches that might want to do a merger or plant here with us. Something like that.
I’ve heard it said that the most effective way to reach people for the Lord is through church planting, can you comment on that?
I’ve used that quote before, I would just add in a couple more adjectives or disclaimers, because if you plant a church that isn’t outreach focused it’s not going to be an effective way, right? You’ve got to have an evangelistic focused church that is engaging in the community and its needs, right> If you’re that kind of church, then a church plant has an opportunity to be one of the key ways you’re going to reach lost people. But if you are not actively engaged in the community and with lost people, you’re not going to start winning lost people just because you plant a church, right? The truth is that many Christians once they’ve been Christians for a long time, don’t have any non-Christian friends. And how are they going too lead lost people to Jesus?
My question is about merging, and do we need to have the board in place (5 Elders) to do that?
You would not need your board in place, but I don’t want to be too proactive and then have you say “No, that’s really not what we want, Rob.” So, If I start talking to churches here in Sacramento that would be interested in planting here and having your congregation brought into membership at their church, and then you say “oh that’s not what we want to do” it puts me in an awkward position with them. So I’m not going to purse that further than I already have until I hear from you.
If the board or congregation decided that we did want to merge, would we have the option of going into redevelopment while you looked for a church to merge with?
That’s a possibility, but I want you to know, right now I don’t have a church that you can merge with. So if you go into redevelopment, it’s for the purpose of moving forward, right? Its not for the purpose of you staying the same.
What’s the time frame assuming that we have someone that wants to come in as a plant? How many months does it take to go through Ordination and approval, etc. And if that person doesn’t cut the mustard so to speak?
So, let’s talk about Woody specifically because I don’t have another potential plan. So, Woody would have to fill out his application and submit that in. Then he would have to sit through an accreditation interview with the licensing council of the district. So, people can fill out the application relatively quickly. Then they have to sit through that process. The question is does he have the prerequisites made? Again, I don’t know because I haven’t seen the application. So, if those things are not done, then he would have to fulfill the prerequisites before he could be accredited. But if someone has all the education, the classes that need to be in place, the polity course, those kinds of things done. The process for accreditation isn’t a lengthy process. Most pastors in a week of time could sit down if they were just working on that easily, have it done in a week. The application, and then they have to go through the interview and that starts the process towards ordination. In that accreditation process we’re looking at is their theological alignment. Can you defend it? Is your marriage healthy? Are you financially healthy? Are you emotionally healthy? We’re looking at well-rounded emotional spiritual health and alignment with the Christian and Missionary Alliance. So that’s what we’re looking at with accreditation. And then the ordination process has a number of steps and components that then lead to the oral exam that comes with ordination. And that’s a 2–3-year process, once you’re accredited and that clock starts ticking to complete the process. It can be done shorter, but it’s usually a 2-year process plus.
Is there a limbo stage? If someone begins the process does everything need to be complete?
So, this is why I think it’s better for you to decide in November what rout you want to go. And the reason is if you decide in the first Sunday or second Sunday in November. This is the route we want to go if it’s going into redevelopment and in that process looking for a pastor you still have time to have conversations about what that looks like. If it’s decided then we want to go to the replant route, then Woody knows he better get it together. If he’s going to be considered for and we have got to see, does he fit. Because that’s not my approval it’s the licensing council’s approval. So that we know what steps need to bake place.
I don’t think it was clear, He can plant once he’s accredited, he doesn’t have to fulfill the 2-year ordination requirement?
When a pastor passes accreditation, they are accredited. They are licensed for a specific role, and you can be licensed as a church planter once you’ve passed accreditation but then you have to start the ordination process. So, you can start that quickly and it wouldn’t be difficult. But I would hold you to as a church you’re going to pay Bruce until he retires, one way or another till he retires. And Bruce is going to serve you as this church family until that point on March 4th. It could look a lot o f different ways, but I want you to know what’s going to happen right.
Woody added a comment that he intends to sit for the accreditation interview with the licensing committee on October 28th.
I want to seek clarification: Under the courses of action there’s maintaining accreditation is the only course of action where the board maintains day-to-day oversight on this community?
Yes
And under redevelopment, DEXCOM takes over the day-to-day from our board, so that we don’t go through a mad rush of finding extra leaders, making sure they’re fit. It gives us a window, allowing us to fall out of accreditation, it gives us a window to not have to worry about certain things?
Correct. And what we have done in the past with another church recently, they were moved into redevelopment, we delegated certain responsibilities to an advisory team. And then decisions beyond that had to come through me and if needed the executive committee of the district. So, it’s allowing for a little bit of relief on the pressure of what we’re doing in that position as well.
There’s a couple people on the payroll besides Bruce, and I think it’s my one thing I would put before the congregation is that we do commit to supporting everyone financial who’s receiving from the church now through at least March regardless of where we go. I would ask that you all put that on your hearts. Especially Christmas coming up. It’s a terrible time for a transition. But and not that’s to say there’s not a future for people who depend on this work past March, but at least through march. I hope you consider that as we move forward regardless of what our meetings look like in the future. Cuz that can make people very emotional.
I don’t think I was very clear on this. I am not saying that we would close and replant before the end of the year. I am not saying that we put the church in redevelopment before the end of the year. You could request that and certainly then we could do that. But what I’d like to see you get through Christmas, and get through the end of the year with whatever decision is going to be made, but make the decision so you know what is going to happen. Then we can take the steps and help the church make a healthy transition process, whatever that looks like. But if we don’t make the decision till January, that puts us in much more of a crunch. And that’s why I am talking to you now, just trying to say hey, there’s options but let’s make the decision sooner rather than later so we have a ramp towards whatever that decision is going to look like.
In terms of another church taking us under their wing, you’re obviously looking for another alliance church, what about Roseville City Church?
That’s a great question, but at this time it’s not an option. Bruce shared he’s been talking with Todd for the 3.5 years about the possibility of that happening, and every time they have had the discussion they have both felt it’s not the right time.
If there is a church plant who is the church plant person, who makes the decision on who that person is, is it fully a district decision?
If it’s a church plant, Hillcrest Church would close, and the church plant would start. So it isn’t a decision the current Hillcrest members get to make. If we go with a church planter, the church planter has to go through assessment, they would go through accreditation, and we have a process we use to assess and work with church planters. So, our church planting director would meet with whoever that person is and walk them through the process. Again, another reason why we want to start the process earlier rather than later.
If there is a church plant, like you mentioned, a lot of people don’t stay, So where do those people come from if there is going to be a church plant?
In our district our goal is to plant as many churches as we can. Key goals of the district are to see 20% conversion growth a year over attendance. See at least 10% baptism growth over attendance, we want to see 10 missionaries sent out in 5 years from our district. We have sent out 6 missionaries in the last 2.5-3 years and have more people in application process for deployment next year. We want to see 50 churches planted in 55 years. So were about 3 years into that process and we have planted 14. And we want to raise up 100 more accredited workers. People who are not currently in alliance ministry raise them up, get them equipped and become accredited workers within the C&MA and we’re at 36 right now. People come from their connections. They come from them going out and seeking to find lost people who want to know Jesus and want to get involved in a church. So, the normal way is a parachute drop type situation. Going into a community start a bible study, then start building a relationship, start building a core, and start a church. Now because Woody is from the area, he might have relationships already. He may have a network of people that are saying “Hey we‘d love to be a part of church if you plant a church” And so that could create what we call a core team. And if some of you may want to be a part of the core team. So that’s how it gets started?
Do you happen to have any statistics on churches that do replant? How many of the old congregation actually do convert over to the new? It seemed based on your previous story, it was a pretty low percentage of people from the old church, were part of the new church?
Yeah so the option is open to them. But I think many times the people are like “no I like my old church, so I don’t really know.
So, replant is in name only – it’s an entirely new church?
Yes it’s an entirely new church. I will say, I did a church plant once and you know when you get into a church plant, one thing about a church plant is its all brand new. You have no history. There’s an exciting expectation that everybody has the same goal, We need to grow. We need to reach people. Its not about maintaining the building, its not about maintaining the way we’ve always done things. Its about something new, fresh, spirit filled, something that’s anointed. And the sole purpose is to reach people. That is exciting to be a part of.
Hillcrest Remains Open
What were the results of the Congregational Interaction? (SWOT Analysis)
Johanna shared the results from the congregational interaction. Which is called a SWOT analysis and included 362 points of data collected from the post it notes activity, congregational discussion, and emails. Through analysis of this data the MST identified 6 key themes.
- Improve how the church is organized and runs day-to-day
- Develop a robust culture of discipleship
- Grow and deepen our Children & Youth Ministries
- Strengthen small groups, fellowship and Spiritual Community
- Expand our local community outreach and Global impact
- Strengthen and Expand our Online Presence.
How can the SWOT analysis be used to select a future pastor?
in healthy accredited churches the pastoral transition process goes through about 6 meetings, several assessments including the SWOT analysis, and asking questions such as:
- What’s our history?
- Who have we been?
- What don’t we like about our history?
- Who are we now as a church?
- What’s good about where we’re at right now?
- What’s not so good about where we’re at right now?
- Where do we want to go?
- What can we keep from our past?
- What absolutely needs to change as we go into the future?
The goal of gathering this information is to take that information and use it to ask potential pastoral candidates in an interview process and see if they can help us accomplish these things and help us avoid what we would like to avoid. Because if they can’t, then everything stays the same. And these questions are vitally important for canidating a new pastor.
Hillcrest Closes & Replants
What’s the progress you’re making right now getting licensed with the C&MA? How is that all that working out right now?
Yeah, so Rob, Rob talked about it a little on Sunday night. Licensing is not a super drawn out process. It’s as complicated as you make it, I think it’s, it’s about the level of rigor that I’d like, although would like to point out that Peter made it to the top of his crew immediately with no boards. But of course, he had Jesus nominating. So you get a bump there. Or nation is about a two year process.
So for those of you who don’t know me from way back, I was, and this is according district’s data, I was 89% complete with ordination, but that was in their old computer system, and when they got to their new computer system, they know the percentage, but I’m now at zero, so I’m starting afresh. And for any of those who’ve had to write a paper and then rewrite the paper because the computer didn’t save it, it feels a little bit like that. But I’ve, I’ve even told I’ve told pastor Bruce, I’ve told Shauna, I’ve told Scott I am taking the time not to regurgitate things that I said 10 years ago or eight years ago. So I have a Master’s of divinity, which is kind of like at the postgraduate level, short of a PhD, about as difficult of a degree as you can work towards for ministry and leadership. I’m not just regurgitating old papers and old writings. I’m investing the time in going back and answering the licensing questions, and then after that, you know, the ordination process.
You do sit before an ordination board, they ask questions like, Hey, can you explain the Trinity? Which, that’s for me. Can you explain the Trinity? Which, if you’ve ever tried to explain the Trinity to five year old, that’s about as hard as it gets. Adults. Is easier because you can use concepts like, we can’t really define that doesn’t fly with a five-year-old. But anyway, so licensing and ordination. Licensing asks the shorthand, what? How do you explain the Trinity? You got like, a paragraph to answer it. That’s pretty easy. I’ve got recommendations rolling in. So for those of you online who wrote the recommendations, thank you, banger. But yeah, it’s a process.
My goal for licensing is to have all my documents submitted by the 21st and then there’s a board that meets on the 28th so you know, God, God willing, and the creeks don’t rise on the 28th before I go to bed, I’ll be licensed for ministry. And then that starts the two-year clock. And I don’t know how maneuverable that two years is, but you know, better than I do what I can do as a licensed pastor.
What have you been doing the last decade or so in Ministry?
doing? That’s a great question. So we’ve talked about this. I’ve talked a bunch of guys. So my heart, my passion is really for Men’s Ministry. I had one of the interesting things, when you get into Men’s Ministry, you realize that how important a father story is. And I have a great dad. He’s not perfect, you know, he’s he’s left handed, like me, so obviously exceptional. But I was, that was way funny guys, all right, no, I have a great foster story, but there’s, there’s a lot of men out there who don’t, I have a wonderful relationship with the Father, and there’s a lot of guys out there who don’t. I’m pretty simple learner and thick headed, you know, I play dumb, but I’m pretty smart, but I just find, I find this relationship with Jesus, you know, man to man, so easy, and it’s really been a calling on my life to help make that more tangible for guys, because I think the culture that raises men in the church today is very much oriented towards how women communicate. And there’s nothing wrong with that. Who did Jesus reveal himself? First, the woman at the well, a Samaritan woman at the well.
But, oh, by the way, that was after calling 12 male disciples specifically. And so I think it’s really important that, at least in the ministry that I do communicating to men in a way that’s going to be tangible for them, not just where they’re at, but where we’re going. Right with Bible talks about men as the head of the household, and it’s not I’m in charge do what I say. It’s love your wife as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her, you need to be willing to die for your family, literally, figuratively, emotionally. And you know, Christ is still the head of the church, so we’re also a key component of the bride in this process. And how do you, you know? How do you wrestle with that in today’s context? I think there’s a massive ministry you guys doing that. So that’s what I’ve been doing.
I’ve pastored men at large for the last so I was called away from here, ran Men’s Ministry at Bayside for a couple of years, finished up my MDiv and went back to what I call lay ministry, or ministry at large, pastoring groups of men. So there’s, there’s probably 100-200 guys around the globe. And it’s not just guys, you know, I do. I pray for pray for women, I pray for couples, I pray for kids. But it’s, you know, a lot of ministry at large. I’ve seen a number of I’ve baptized a number of people. Seen a ton of people come to Christ. I say we, when you hear me say we, I don’t have like this. It’s not bipolar like me.
We always means, means her and I, or them all plus, right, our family or Shauna and I. Shauna and I have done about two weddings on average over the last few years. I used to do the premarital counseling on my own. It sucks on my own. It’s way better with her, and it’s super fun. So one of the things that we did for a season, we had three couples, and they would come over, and the guys would go outside, and the girls would stay inside, and we’d go through the same material, we come back together, and then we talk about it and just and, you know, Sean is connecting with the ladies throughout the week. She’s not a super texter communicator. She’s very much like in the zone, and she’s introvert. Opposites attract. But it’s really, it’s, it’s just been this sweet spot. And we actually got to sit down. We went to one young couple’s wedding. We officiated in Cabo, and we had also officiated, I had also officiated her younger sister’s wedding, and I hadn’t seen that couple for a while, and they were long distance, so it was the first time they got down with Shauna and I, and we went out one evening. This this first wedding younger sister just got me, which is way less than half. So it was our night with Shauna and Courtney and Alex and I, and we kind of went through all the premarital again, but as a group. And I mean, we were in Cabo Sunday, because all we wanted to do was sit and talk about Jesus and how he makes marriages better. It was super, fun. So that’s been a huge blessing raising my kids.
And for those of you who aren’t seeing our our little Bible videos, it’s it’s been a blast. Matt, no have been a key component of my formal education, because while I was working on my Master’s in divinity, before I tried to complete a thought on something theological, leadership doesn’t matter. I would try and explain it to Matt, and he was five. Did Matt pick it up? Did he get it? Oh, he’s pretty good. You know what’s funny, though, Noah. Noah, his theology is off the church. He could, he could, he could outreach half the people I see on the internet today. And he’s 10, but it has been super neat, because I have this immediate feedback from younger minds. Who are? They’re not going to just nod no like that doesn’t make any sense, and it’s so it’s been super awesome. So we do. I’ve been, I was doing these little daily Devos for Susan, Bianca and Greg, three people that I’ve just prayed with and for forever.
And then Noah started getting involved when we turned them into videos. And now it’s like a family thing, where we do these daily Devos, so baptisms, weddings, ministry at large, primarily for men and marriage, and then just encouraging families to get in the Word. Because I think, I think a lot of people our culture today has made it seem like to the bar should be set extremely high for dads, for husbands, for parents, for Christians, but the entry fee is super low, right? Because it’s while the standard is perfection, the entry fee is grace. And so we’re striving for this, but all we need to get in is nothing on our own, and it’s super cool. It’s super cool. So that’s been, that’s been our ministry for the last decade.
When was the last time you shared the Gospel?
I mean, besides the sermon, yeah, Friday. Friday, and it was out. So, so my, of the many hats I wear, right? Don’t, don’t be a Don’t. Don’t be a terrible ambassador for Jesus Christ. Again. Bar low, standard high. Be an okay husband. She keeps coming around. So lots of, lots of prayers for that lady. Be a decent dad. Also run firearms company. And so I was out at a range Friday, and we had one Christian, one non Christian, and just I, it’s so it is so easy to tie the Kristyn walk with getting better at hitting the target in firearms. Like it’s it’s fish in a barrel, and it’s literally, like, as I’m sitting there, it’s everything I talk about, talks about Christ is the center, center of the target and and if you’re off target and you’re not keeping track, there are ways to figure out what is driving you off target. So if you’re low left on target as a right handed shooter, I can tell you you’re not just anticipating recoil. You’re you’ve got sympathetic manipulation of your left hand while you’re anticipating recall. So shots go on the left in the same way, if your goal is Christ and your marriage sucks and your wife doesn’t want to just sit there and talk to you for an hour a day, you’re a bad listener, right? It’s not that complicated, like, just shut up and listen. And it’s, you know, you can so I can get you back on target if we’re at the range, but I can get you back on target in your marriage just as easily, because I’m a simple guy, I break everything down to what’s the next step. And Scott’s laughing because we talked about this. We’ve been talking about this for a decade. Yeah? So, Friday, okay, Friday,
What’s Your Vision?
Yeah, Bruce asked that yesterday, to know Christ and make him known. And I’m stealing that from the navigators. If you don’t know who the navigators are, I’d love to introduce you to know Christ, to make Him known. For this church, to know Christ, to make Him known, I think, for those of us who have seen Hillcrest over the years, and I’m not saying I’ve been here. I mean, we’ve been here for a couple months. We were here a couple of years ago. Some of you have been here decades, and God bless you for all that you’ve given to the church, your time, your talents, your treasures. It is, you know, we are all doing it out of gratitude for what God has given us, but Jesus also promises that in what we invest will be rewarded in heaven. I don’t think that that’s metaphorical. I think it’s theological. I think there’s a reality to what we put in we’re going to see rewards above and beyond what we could ever imagine. So for those of you who’ve been pouring into this community, thank you.
Actually, thank can we get for those of you who are sitting in this nice building that we didn’t pay for? You know this, this costs money. This is, I think, is a beautiful space to worship so but the first thing I told Bruce when we started talking a couple months ago is we got to close the church, and Rob talked about this the other night, and that’s hard to that’s hard to hear. It’s hard to say, But Rob brought it up. In the last 10 years, membership has grown by on average, 0% over the last 30 years, membership has decreased by 67% giving over the last 30 years, has decreased by a number that I’m not going to say.
Over the last 10 years, it’s decreased by about 30% these are hard numbers. Jesus says, this is your Peter on this rock. Oh, build my church, and then what the gates of hell shall not be able to stop you if a functioning group of believers advances on the gates of hell, we don’t lose ground. God does everything. God does all of the work. And I’m not saying we have no role in it. I’m just saying I worry very little about the impact of the decisions I make in the advancement of his kingdom. I put everything I can into what I think he’s called me to do, and I deal with joy, and I do it with very little anxiety, because I cannot out screw up God’s grace. He is going to win every time every bad decision I make, he’s already got a plan to work it together for good, for those who are called according to His purpose, when you see a group of Christians that is not advancing against the gates of hell, how long has that been going on? Right? We all have a slump. 10 years is not a slump. Something’s wrong. So in an army, we call it take a tactical pause. So if you’re on an advance and you start losing or your advances in advancing, you got to take a tactical pause. You’re going to lose lives.
And what we’re what we’re not doing here, is gaining lives for Christ. So what’s going on? I don’t know, but it to me, it would be much easier to say, hey, and this is not this. This is not the end all be all. Bruce’s pastor, at least through his retirement, but my recommendation to him was, close the doors after Christmas, open the doors of Easter as a new church, as a replant. Well, what do we do for three months?
Anybody? I mean, I would love to sleep in every Sunday for three months. I actually love this more than sleeping in. So couple of easy recommendations, again, Bruce’s pastor, depending on what Rob places me in the process, and I’ll have input, but all of you have five people who live closest to your bed. My four of my five happen to live at the same address. And then Chris’s son, I don’t know who that is, is probably the next closest room my neighbor, right? But Jesus says, Love your neighbor. So all of you have five humans that live close to you. Of the five humans that you’re not related to that live closest to you, three of them don’t go to church, statistically, right? So everybody pause for a second and think about the three people that you would call a literal neighbor that don’t go to church. What are they doing right now? Do you even know go and hang out with them on a Sunday morning, not every Sunday morning. Eventually, you want, we want you to bring them to hang out with us, right? That’s the point. That’s how we grow churches. Love our neighbors. Introduce them to Jesus. Jesus plants them in the community, and then they go and they love more neighbors, and pretty soon our whole street loves Jesus. It’s fantastic, right? So go hang out with your neighbors.
Figure out what they’re doing, go to somebody else’s church. Go to somebody else. I’ve got dozens of friends who have churches around here. I’d love to send you to one of theirs. They’re doing stuff we’re not doing that you would love for us to be doing. So write that down, we are doing stuff they’re not doing that you want to make sure we keep doing. Write that one down, both of us are doing stuff you don’t like at all that we should stop or vice versa. Write that down, right? Go experience other churches and come back with ideas of what is and is not working out. Well. Love your neighbors.
Go experience other churches, and if you can’t find one of the other ones to do, and please don’t make this all you do. If we go with this, don’t make this all you do. January, February, March, up until April 15. Is eighth or eighth or east. Don’t just hang out with these people, because it’s not working. Okay? I love you guys. Love them better. It’s okay. They’re gonna take care of me when I’m old. Don’t just hang out with these people. It’s not working. Go find new people and go find what new people want to do on a Sunday. Does that make sense? But don’t leave I mean, look, if, if that’s not your bag of tricks, the City Church is right over there. They’re going to look very much like this. I’m sure pastor Todd would love to have you. It’s a block away. You could walk you park here and walk there. I don’t know what time they start, but it’s probably close to 1030 if you just can’t face that much change. There’s a building right over there that’s not going to change much. Okay,
This, this building. What Rob’s vision is that this church, whatever it is, is going to be reaching people for Jesus Christ, because that’s what he told us to do. Go therefore, make disciples of all nations, baptizing them the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I’ve commanded you, well, hold on with you till the end of the age. Can I get an amen?